Rivalries/Hatred

Delboy · Post by **Delboy** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:19 pm

Hello

What would ye say are the various county rivalries/hatred?

Definition of rivalry - don't like to see the other county do well
Definition of hatred - hate to see the feckers even win a match

Eg. Hatred - Tipp/Clare Offaly/wastemeath
Rivalry - Cork/Waterford

Just wondering what counties have hatred for other counties

azoffaly · Post by **azoffaly** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:36 pm

I would define Rivalry as 'Always want to beat them when you play them'

Hatred would be 'Always want to see them beaten no matter who they are playing'.

Westmeath are the former to me, whereas the likes of Galway would be the latter.

TheManFromFerbane · Post by **TheManFromFerbane** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:37 pm

Why what's wrong with Galway?

Westmeath\Dublin\Meath - Rivals
Laois\Laois\Laois - Hatred

Lone Shark · Post by **Lone Shark** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:46 pm

I'd be shy of hatred with most counties - even time has mellowed my dislike of the Wasties, albeit largely because the bulk of their summer following has reverted to following Celtic, or Athlone Town, or Chelsea, or whatever it is they do. As with all these things, the residual crowd is usually not too bad.

Wexford would be the only ones I can't stand. Some of the bitterness after THEY won in that football qualifier in 2004 was incredible. Apparently having the temerity to walk down the street in an Offaly jersey was offence enough. Plus holding a large shark, of course.

azoffaly · Post by **azoffaly** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:22 pm

Galway is probably before your time TMFF, it is really about hurling. Again, only a rivalry, rather than out and out hatred. I'd not be upset if Galway won an All Ireland. Sorry I just realised why you asked. I meant of course Galway would be the former and Westmeath the latter. Even though I don't really *hate* Westmeath, I'd just find it verrrrry hard to listen to them if they won anything again.

Loneshark, I agree about that debacle in Wexford. I have a feeling there was a large 'townie' element that evening though. I've shared a few evenings in the Big Tree over the years with Wexford hurling fans after games, winning and losing, and the craic and singing has always been good.

That evening did have one of the better quotes of that year though. As we disconsolately made our way off the terrace, with the Shark being a little deflated literally, and his followers figuratively, a Wexford lad said 'Cheer Up Sharkie, worse things happen at sea'.

DD · Post by DD » Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:17 pm

You want hatred...I'd sooner remove my eyeballs with a spoon than see Dublin footballers win an All-Ireland again. Their players, management and fans showed their true colours again at the weekend but with the Dub love in on this site, I'm sure not many will agree..

Delboy · Post by **Delboy** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:24 pm

A Mayo buddy of mine thinks that Offaly are the only county that hate their neighbours particularly Laois & wastemeath.

He says Galway would support Mayo.

I know Galway hurling supporters who are bitter over 81 & 85 and are more than happy when Offaly lose

The Magpie · Post by **The Magpie** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:26 pm

Why don't we ask the same Hatred / Rivalry question at club-level. There's some sweet ones out there.

Rivalry: Clara/Ferbane
Hatred: Rhode/Edenderry (at least, that's my perception!)

mykneehurts · Post by **mykneehurts** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 6:52 pm

It all depends on what one thinks of when they think of the teams in question. My hatred of Westmeath was drilled into me from an early age from my mother (who is from Clara) because the people of Kilbeggan hung Down flags on All-Ireland final day 1961 so that the Clara crowd going to the match would know how much they wanted to see Offaly beaten. The funny thing is apparently half of Kilbeggan wouldn't have a job if it wasn't for Goodbody's factory in Clara. (Maybe Magpie can confirm or deny this) I know it is going back a long way but for me the Westmeath crowd havn't changed a bit since then. I work in Athlone and you can hear the falseness in their voices when they say they hope we do well.

In contrast my hatred of Laois stems from the players' arrogance. TMFF will surely agree with me in saying they are the cockiest w*****s to play against at any level but that seems to be limited to the footballers and the bit of success they have had. Really I hate to see Laois go well in football but would like to see them go well in the hurling.

As for rivalries, I think they are just a few tough games away from being hatred. If either Ferbane or Clara edged out the other say three years in a row in championship that rivalry wouldn't be long about becoming hatred.

Also, hatred or rivalry can be a one way thing sometimes. For instance, supposedly Cloghan sang about how much they hate Ferbane after they won the Intermediate a couple of years ago but I don't think the feeling is mutual. In the same vein, Offaly would probably think they have a bit of a rivalry with Dublin but I would imagine the Dubs would put both Meath and Laois ahead of us in that respect.

Anyway, this is what I think our real rivalries are:
Offaly/Dublin (from my point of view, I wouldn't mind seeing Dublin win an All-Ireland)
Ferbane/Clara

and our hatreds:
Offaly/Westmeath
Ferbane/Edenderry (or could be Shannonbridge either)

Lone Shark · Post by **Lone Shark** » Wed Jul 18, 2007 2:45 am

azoffaly wrote: Loneshark, I agree about that debacle in Wexford. I have a feeling there was a large 'townie' element that evening though. I've shared a few evenings in the Big Tree over the years with Wexford hurling fans after games, winning and losing, and the craic and singing has always been good.

No question we got a bad sample that evening, that's without doubt. Just in general I find a lot of strawberry pickers are inclined to bear a grudge for games gone by, and to take it out on any Offaly person they meet. Of course there are good 'uns too, but I don't blame all Westmeath folk for the blind umpire three years ago, or all Kildare people for Paddy Russell's treachery in 2002. These things happen, but moving on doesn't seem to be their strong point.

mykneehurts wrote:It all depends on what one thinks of when they think of the teams in question. My hatred of Westmeath was drilled into me from an early age from my mother (who is from Clara) because the people of Kilbeggan hung Down flags on All-Ireland final day 1961 so that the Clara crowd going to the match would know how much they wanted to see Offaly beaten. The funny thing is apparently half of Kilbeggan wouldn't have a job if it wasn't for Goodbody's factory in Clara. (Maybe Magpie can confirm or deny this) I know it is going back a long way but for me the Westmeath crowd havn't changed a bit since then. I work in Athlone and you can hear the falseness in their voices when they say they hope we do well.

Ditto with the AI final story. My grandmother was originally from Clara, but was living in Moate at the time, and Grandad, being from Brideswell originally and having none of the local stuff, hung out an Offaly flag, only for all the neighbours to hang out Down colours. Took him a bit by surprise, he got a bit of grief for hanging out the Offaly colours as well.

All that said, I think we just get the worst of the Westmeath crowd down this end. Maybe Rhode people will log on now and say the boys the far end are just as bad, but I genuinely think that the bandwagonners and soccer type fans are a lot more prevalent at this end of the county.

mykneehurts wrote:In contrast my hatred of Laois stems from the players' arrogance. TMFF will surely agree with me in saying they are the cockiest w*****s to play against at any level but that seems to be limited to the footballers and the bit of success they have had. Really I hate to see Laois go well in football but would like to see them go well in the hurling.

Nouveau riche - always the way. At this stage Offaly have fallen so far that we're largely left with very little other than hardcore - and if you're still supporting Offaly these days you've known plenty of lean days/years so you know better than to rub it in to the others after you've had a good day or to be too cocky since you know the bad day is just around the corner. Obviously it would be a price I'd happily pay looking at the greater scheme of things, but a little bit of me dreads the day when we do win a Leinster or two and the summer brigade comes back on board. I dread to think we'd be like Laois or Westmeath in recent years, but I've no doubt we would be.

mykneehurts wrote:For instance, supposedly Cloghan sang about how much they hate Ferbane after they won the Intermediate a couple of years ago

Ara sure all rowdy little teenagers go on about how much they hate their parents - it's part of growing up. Still, I'm sure deep down they know who's in charge ...

Delboy wrote:A Mayo buddy of mine thinks that Offaly are the only county that hate their neighbours particularly Laois & wastemeath.

He says Galway would support Mayo.

I'm guessing he's from Achill or somewhere about 100 miles from a border. Ask the fellas around Tuam and Claremorris if they'd support each other, you might get a different answer....

DD wrote:You want hatred...I'd sooner remove my eyeballs with a spoon than see Dublin footballers win an All-Ireland again. Their players, management and fans showed their true colours again at the weekend but with the Dub love in on this site, I'm sure not many will agree..

Nah, that carry on at the weekend towards the end of the match was a disgrace all right. Fair play to Darren Rooney for having the stones to keep his hands by his side and not lay Vaughan out with one swift wallop. It's the kind of thing that would make you hope that the two teams will meet again and he'll get another pot at him. On the other hand I'm sure somebody like Ryan McMenamin or Marc Ó'Sé will probably do the needful down the line ...

I just lived in Dublin for a long time and got to know a lot of the good 'uns up there. I'll grant you that if you only ever met the summer brigade they'd be a hard bunch to like.

Bord na Mona man · Post by **Bord na Mona man** » Wed Jul 18, 2007 8:16 am

My biggest dislike would be Wastemeath.
Granted, I live close to the border, so I would say that.
Up until 40 years ago, both counties were as poor as each other, so it probably stuck in their throats that Offaly lifted themselves several notches and achieved a bit of success.
If Offaly had been lording it over of them since the foundation of the GAA, then they probably wouldn't have minded it so much.

Granted there are some grand Westmeath supporters, but I find there are a good few in the South of the county who have a real attitude. Especially the ones who, 13 or 14 years ago wouldn't cross the road to watch their county play.

Them winning the Leinster in '04 was probably a good thing though.
The penny has now dropped that winning a Leinster doesn't lead to a dam burst of All Irelands. For a couple of years, they seemed itching to proclaim themselves the new Kerry.
Expectations have become more realistic again having being bloated by the underage All Irelands in the 90s.

I will say from my limited knowledge of them, the Westmeath players are decent skins, whereas I find a few of the Laois footballers hard to stomach.
Also Leix have now attracted a large entourage of the most ridiculously cocky supporters of all time.

The best example of this was when they beat Derry in 2005 in Croke Park. I did a lap of the stadium (it was the first half of a double header and they were all going home btw) when the final whistle went. Without exception, pouring out of every exit were Laois boors roaring and bawling about how they had downed Ulster football, bring on everyone else kinda thing and informing innocent bystanders that this was how you play football. Needless to say their white booted heroes were annihilated by Armagh the next day out.

This is from the same county that for the Leinster semi final against Dublin in 1999 sold a grand total of 800 tickets. Mick O'Dwyer should be put on trial for the bandwagon he created!
There is a hardcore of great bread and butter, hardy hoor, traditional GAA person in Laois, but the new townie element I can't abide by at all.

Offaly have never had any sustained run in either code to attract such a bandwagon. There has always been a defeat to send the newbie faction home vowing to "never watch that shower again". However if the circumstances were right, there would be the same luders making a show of themselves and the county. Unfortunately, empty vessels make most noise.

As regards Wexford, I have found that their older generation can be very resentful of Offaly. A big thing for them years ago was to bask in the reflected glory of Kilkenny. Running the All Ireland champions close in a Leinster final was good enough for them. Much the same way that Tipp fans love bleating about traditional Munster finals with Cork, much more than Cork fans do. There's a neediness there. Also there would be townie element to their support as seen in Wexford Park in '04. That said Wexford have a huge core of very loyal and decent fans whose continued support of their county is an example to everyone else and unparalleled in any other county.

DD · Post by DD » Wed Jul 18, 2007 9:18 am

Lone Shark wrote:
I just lived in Dublin for a long time and got to know a lot of the good 'uns up there. I'll grant you that if you only ever met the summer brigade they'd be a hard bunch to like.

Oh no.. I lived in Dublin for long enough myself - I know them intimately

I'd like to comment on two things that really get on my tits about them...

One of the worst things that does seem to have happened with the carry on of the thousands of JCL's in recent years is that a lot of people (i.e culchies) now look at the Dublin fixture in Croker and decide it's not worth going because they feel it's a totally uncomfortable day out.
I dunno how many people (in particular those that like to bring their families to games) I spoke to recently from the Edenderry, Rhode & Clonbullogue area that said they were not travelling this year because of the Dubs antics last year.
Even last week I spoke to a lot of Laois supporters who were going to give it a miss for the same reasons. Now I don't give a flying fuck how great some on here think the Dubs are but this does not happen with any other county.

The other issue I have is with the majority of Dubliners that have upped sticks and decided they want to raise their families in the relative safety (and/or affordability) of parts of Offaly, Westmeath, Laois etc.
Now I can understand anyone from any county that relocates elsewhere trying to maintain their identity to the place they were born and raised but putting the blue jersey on their own children in the cot is typical of so many.
They are trying to raise their kids as Dubs even though they are not. I know of loads of kids that tell their schoolmates "I'm from Dublin" despite the fact that apart from visiting their grannies every few months they have never even lived there (nor their parents have any intention of them going back there either).

TheManFromFerbane · Post by **TheManFromFerbane** » Wed Jul 18, 2007 9:19 am

Lone Shark wrote:
mykneehurts wrote:For instance, supposedly Cloghan sang about how much they hate Ferbane after they won the Intermediate a couple of years ago

The day they stop hating you is when you should get worried

I think from all the posts above its fair to say the biggest hatred of them all is:

Country Vs Townie!

Lone Shark · Post by **Lone Shark** » Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:23 pm

DD wrote: One of the worst things that does seem to have happened with the carry on of the thousands of JCL's in recent years is that a lot of people (i.e culchies) now look at the Dublin fixture in Croker and decide it's not worth going because they feel it's a totally uncomfortable day out.
I dunno how many people (in particular those that like to bring their families to games) I spoke to recently from the Edenderry, Rhode & Clonbullogue area that said they were not travelling this year because of the Dubs antics last year.
Even last week I spoke to a lot of Laois supporters who were going to give it a miss for the same reasons. Now I don't give a flying fuck how great some on here think the Dubs are but this does not happen with any other county.

I'd say that a lot of that depends on (a) how sensitive you are, and (b) what you think is entailed in your "day out". I would argue that if you were to travel up to Armagh and Tyrone in Clones and go into some of the hardiest local spots like the Paragon you might find yourself being a little bit uneasy too. I'll grant you the Dub "wit" can be a little bit sharper than most, but barring you plonk yourself on the middle of the Hill amidst all the coke snorters and bottle throwers (which would equally apply to Tipp supporters on the Killanin end and several others incidentally) it's really no different. I'm not saying you haven't had bad days, much like I have done with Meath in particular, but I find that a lot of people feel threatened by the Dubs because quite simply we're used to hearing the Marino/Fairview twang and being a little on edge.

DD wrote: The other issue I have is with the majority of Dubliners that have upped sticks and decided they want to raise their families in the relative safety (and/or affordability) of parts of Offaly, Westmeath, Laois etc.
Now I can understand anyone from any county that relocates elsewhere trying to maintain their identity to the place they were born and raised but putting the blue jersey on their own children in the cot is typical of so many.
They are trying to raise their kids as Dubs even though they are not. I know of loads of kids that tell their schoolmates "I'm from Dublin" despite the fact that apart from visiting their grannies every few months they have never even lived there (nor their parents have any intention of them going back there either).

I've met just as many exiled Biffos in Dublin who'd do the same with theirs - it's only natural. Once the kid get's to 7/8 years of age they toddle down to the local club, they support the same team as all their mates, and 90% of parents, be they exiled Dubs or wherever just accept it.

arbarg · Post by **arbarg** » Wed Jul 18, 2007 5:36 pm

Tullamore/clara