Offaly minor football panel 2025

A forum to air your views on Offaly GAA matters and beyond.
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Lone Shark
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Re: Offaly minor football panel 2025

Post by Lone Shark »

Thomas mc wrote: Mon Jun 09, 2025 5:24 pm That's up to players and managers and parents to help manage that, whatever way you look at it 17 and 18 year old kids left with no choice is just silly particularly in clubs where they are needed.. if you look at the likes of West Offaly where young lads are joined up to that age and aren't gettin a game with the joined up clubs but might be good enough to play a part with their own club at adult level, it's very unfair and plenty lads in this situation who won't wait til u19 to get a kick of a ball, plenty of those lads lost and will be lost but they get the chance to play with their club where they get game time at a decent level, build a bit of confidence and wanted and part of a team and they stay at it.. plenty lads played senior at 16 and 17 never did them any harm. If you're under 18 next year who do you play football with?

(1) First of all, there's nothing "unfair" about it. It's the same rules for everyone.
(2) Plenty of lads played senior at 16 and 17 and it never did them any harm, plenty of lads played senior at 16 and 17 and it did. And there have never been more overuse injuries in the GAA than there are right now. Moreover, adult players are built different now, they hit differently. Sure, there aren't anything like the same number of corner backs who made a career out of dishing out sneaky digs to clip the wings of a teenage corner forward, but the average 25 year old club player is now 100kg weight, 10-12% body fat, and able to move at pace that when he arrives to give a shoulder, even if it's perfectly fair, it's delivered with vastly more force than used to be the case.
I think we can all agree too that Cillian Bourke is not your average 18 year old, you can't make rules based on the likes of him. For every Dan Ravenhill, there's an Adam Screeney - you have to make the rules to cover all, not just the six foot, broad-shouldered lads.
(3) You can say it's up to players/parents/managers to manage that, but we've a long history in the GAA of how that will be managed., Players will want to play every game they can. Some parents will try to protect their kids, some won't - and the manager will do what he needs to do for his team to win the next game, he will not think of the long-term consequences, barring he also happens to be the teenager's father, or a friend of the family. And in all cases, the manager and the club will expect Offaly GAA to manage the situation for them, i.e. to magically create a fixture schedule that somehow gives lots of games to the lad who only plays for one team, and yet simultaneously gives decent breaks between games to the player whose playing for 4-6 teams. Their idea of "managing" the situation will be for someone else to fix it for them.
(4) Nobody will be left "waiting until U-19 to get a kick of a ball". There will be U-18 competitions, and they will be good competitions. Just because the games don't get covered by the local paper doesn't mean that they're bad games. In fact in a lot of cases, the level of development at a good and progressive U-18 team will be a lot better than what a player will get with a struggling IFC or JFC team, where everything is geared towards survival. And if it's the case that they aren't getting that with their club/combined U-18 team, then the problem is that club/combination. That's what needs to be fixed, not changing the whole games programme to work around it.
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

jimbob17
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Re: Offaly minor football panel 2025

Post by jimbob17 »

Fully agree with all of LS comments above.
jimbob

Thomas mc
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Re: Offaly minor football panel 2025

Post by Thomas mc »

Lone Shark wrote: Wed Jun 11, 2025 11:55 am
Thomas mc wrote: Mon Jun 09, 2025 5:24 pm That's up to players and managers and parents to help manage that, whatever way you look at it 17 and 18 year old kids left with no choice is just silly particularly in clubs where they are needed.. if you look at the likes of West Offaly where young lads are joined up to that age and aren't gettin a game with the joined up clubs but might be good enough to play a part with their own club at adult level, it's very unfair and plenty lads in this situation who won't wait til u19 to get a kick of a ball, plenty of those lads lost and will be lost but they get the chance to play with their club where they get game time at a decent level, build a bit of confidence and wanted and part of a team and they stay at it.. plenty lads played senior at 16 and 17 never did them any harm. If you're under 18 next year who do you play football with?

(1) First of all, there's nothing "unfair" about it. It's the same rules for everyone.
(2) Plenty of lads played senior at 16 and 17 and it never did them any harm, plenty of lads played senior at 16 and 17 and it did. And there have never been more overuse injuries in the GAA than there are right now. Moreover, adult players are built different now, they hit differently. Sure, there aren't anything like the same number of corner backs who made a career out of dishing out sneaky digs to clip the wings of a teenage corner forward, but the average 25 year old club player is now 100kg weight, 10-12% body fat, and able to move at pace that when he arrives to give a shoulder, even if it's perfectly fair, it's delivered with vastly more force than used to be the case.
I think we can all agree too that Cillian Bourke is not your average 18 year old, you can't make rules based on the likes of him. For every Dan Ravenhill, there's an Adam Screeney - you have to make the rules to cover all, not just the six foot, broad-shouldered lads.
(3) You can say it's up to players/parents/managers to manage that, but we've a long history in the GAA of how that will be managed., Players will want to play every game they can. Some parents will try to protect their kids, some won't - and the manager will do what he needs to do for his team to win the next game, he will not think of the long-term consequences, barring he also happens to be the teenager's father, or a friend of the family. And in all cases, the manager and the club will expect Offaly GAA to manage the situation for them, i.e. to magically create a fixture schedule that somehow gives lots of games to the lad who only plays for one team, and yet simultaneously gives decent breaks between games to the player whose playing for 4-6 teams. Their idea of "managing" the situation will be for someone else to fix it for them.
(4) Nobody will be left "waiting until U-19 to get a kick of a ball". There will be U-18 competitions, and they will be good competitions. Just because the games don't get covered by the local paper doesn't mean that they're bad games. In fact in a lot of cases, the level of development at a good and progressive U-18 team will be a lot better than what a player will get with a struggling IFC or JFC team, where everything is geared towards survival. And if it's the case that they aren't getting that with their club/combined U-18 team, then the problem is that club/combination. That's what needs to be fixed, not changing the whole games programme to work around it.

Name the lads that it has harmed playing at 17 or 18?? And you say the problem is with the club/combination? You know too well probably better than anyone over the last 15 or 20 odd year there are plenty of people from on club left sitting on the sideline and not given a chance, the main club in the amalgamation is in charge and you can't just "change" that.. don't need to change the whole games program, let them be available and manage it.. and playing with a good u18 team is better for developing to play with an adult team than and actual adult team that they aren't actually allowed play with?? And you say it's the same for everyone and it's not unfair, well actually no it is unfair and not the same for everyone, there's a big difference I'm Tullamore and their numbers and a small club struggling for numbers who need the players and who have players who are dying to play with their club and play some football.. I've seen plenty of lads lost where they were left sitting on a sideline given no chance by the big club in the "amalgamation" likewise I've seen plenty of lads develop playing with the adult team in their own club where they were needed and felt part of a team and stayed playing because of that. All well and good if you don't care about the survival of the smalls clubs but some people do and having players like this available is important for the club at the time but also for the future so they are not lost .

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Lone Shark
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Re: Offaly minor football panel 2025

Post by Lone Shark »

(1) I'm not going to name individual players and their medical history on here, but you can't be serious when you say "who did it harm". This is Offaly - immediately after the U-20 football All-Ireland win, we had a plethora of injuries and lads from that team missed huge chunks of time. The same happened to last year's hurlers, we were operating with four or five lads out at all times. It's a rare elite player who gets to age 22 or 23 now without missing 6-12 months at some stage of their career, and there are several academic studies on overuse injuries in the GAA, which are easy to find. Hip and back injuries, osteitis pubis, Gilmore's groin, incidence rates of all these injuries is on the rise, and again, that's all easy to find in academic papers. Dr. Pat O'Neill's work, done in conjunction with the GPA, is the most commonly cited.

(2) If there are situations you describe, where the manager of a minor combination team is favouring one club over another, that is self-defeating nonsense and no doubt frustrating for the players involved, but it is not Offaly GAA's issue to fix. But even if that's happening, the guys who are missing out unfairly are not the players who would be getting playing time with a decent adult team. Sure, an 18yo in that bracket might get a run with a Junior B or Junior C team that are tight for numbers, but there is no way that a player would get meaningful playing time with Walsh Island is not getting picked for St. Broughan's. There is no way that a player who would get meaningful game time with Shannonbridge is not getting picked for Ferbane/Belmont, and so on across the board. I'd love to hear your examples of players who got significant playing time at any grade from Junior A up, but they didn't get picked for their club minor team the same year.

(3) People always think this decoupling rule favours the smaller clubs, but in my experience, it can affect anyone equally, so yes, it is fair.

Who was the most significant 18yo playing adult games in Offaly last year? Cillian Bourke by a mile, to the point that it's not a stretch to say that Tullamore might not have won the county final without him. Go back a year, and who was the most important 18yo? Screeney for KK.

I remember the same debate in Roscommon when they initially tried to have 18yos play minor and adult. Small clubs screamed that they needed them most, then St. Brigid's won a county title because they could pick Ruaidhrí Fallon and Ben O'Carroll. Fallon physically dominated Enda Smith in a county semi-final two months before his 18th birthday.

Another perspective is that a player who sustains a long-term injury or a chronic injury is a bigger loss to a smaller club, because each single player is so vital to the cause. To pick two lads from this year's teams, I don't know whether Tomás Carroll or Caden O'Beirne will be the better defender as they mature into adulthood, but I do know that Carroll playing 15 years of adult football is a lot more important to Erin Rovers than O'Beirne playing 15 years is to Tullamore.

(4) There is ZERO evidence, from any of the counties that have been operating this system for a while, that it leads to increased drop off. Your closing line says that these players need to be available so that they are not lost. I know the answer to this before I ask it, but have you any links or data to back this up? Or is it more 'gut feeling' analysis?
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Lone Shark
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Re: Offaly minor football panel 2025

Post by Lone Shark »

https://x.com/ElectricIreland/status/19 ... 35/photo/1

I have to say, this made me more angry than I should be comfortable to admit. I know how these things work - one or two national journalists get roped in to make the selection, and in many cases, the same national journalists haven't seen a single game, barring maybe the final. They're not getting paid to do it so they sit in on a zoom call and spoof their way through.

But even so, if you made a modicum of effort, you won't have come up with anything close to this. This is perhaps the worst one of these teams I've ever seen.

Yes, Tyrone and Kerry were better than every other county this year, but 13 selections between the two of them is to fundamentally misunderstand how teams win at minor level. Kerry didn't scrape over the line against Cavan because they had six star players and Cavan had none, they scraped over the line because they had more depth, and no obvious weak links.

Even the two token players from outside Kerry and Tyrone are farcical choices. Due to where I live, I've seen lots of the two Connacht teams: Ben Holmes was barely in the top five players for Mayo this year, and Dara Curran was probably not in the top five Roscommon players. Don't get me wrong, they're two talented young players and they could go on to have great senior careers for their county so I don't mean to malign them, and that's not what I'm doing. But if you saw even one Mayo game this year, or if you contacted any Mayo reporter, they would tell you that Dara Flanagan was the star of the show. Offaly people saw that firsthand in the Hyde too.

Any Rossies would have said in a heartbeat that Diarmuid O'Higgins was the big story of the year, almost impassable at full-back and MOTM in several of their games. I'd be surprised if there are more than one or two defenders who were better than O'Higgins this year, never mind six.

Outside of that, and leaving aside Cian McNamee here in Offaly who should have been an automatic selection with Jack Ryan not far behind (I'll admit the Tyrone keeper was very good), you had Conor Burke (Clare), Tom Maguire and Connell Kelly (Louth), Jamie Gavigan (Donegal) and no doubt several others. Okay, maybe you can't include them all, but any one of those would be a safer bet for me to make a senior career than more than half of the lads that were actually picked. More importantly, they all had incredible seasons as individuals, leading their teams with real responsibility and guts.

And perhaps the biggest tell-tale sign of all is that Joel Kerr was one of Tyrone's best players all year, standing out by a mile, but because he missed out on the final due to his professional soccer contract, he's not included.

Like I said, irrationally angry is how it has left me.
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

SizeFive2024
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Re: Offaly minor football panel 2025

Post by SizeFive2024 »

They just picked from lads in the final, no dount Jack Ryan, Caden O'Beirne, Eoin Rouse, Cian McNamee, Rurai Woods and Dylan Dunne make it into their teams..relax

ah lethimoutwithit
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Re: Offaly minor football panel 2025

Post by ah lethimoutwithit »

SizeFive2024 wrote: Thu Aug 07, 2025 10:34 pm They just picked from lads in the final, no dount Jack Ryan, Caden O'Beirne, Eoin Rouse, Cian McNamee, Rurai Woods and Dylan Dunne make it into their teams..relax
I don't know what this means above?

I wouldn't be too worried about any of this as is so subjective at this age as to be irrelevant. We went from being one of the weaker teams in Leinster after the first 2 games and barely scraping past Wicklow to being a kick away from the All Ireland semi final. All stars no, but resillience is a far better word to have attached to your name these days!

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Re: Offaly minor football panel 2025

Post by Tar Man »

I was at a good few of the Offaly games and watched a lot of other games on-line and the best player in the Championship in my opinion was the Louth Midfielder Tom Maguire - how he didn't make this team beggars belief

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Re: Offaly minor football panel 2025

Post by Tmacmahon »

What type of team will Roger have at minor next year , ( if he doesn't take 20s)

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